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	<title>Comments for The North West Passage</title>
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	<description>Where Thousands are Sailing</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Fri, 02 Dec 2011 06:37:37 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>Comment on Am I the 99%? by Arcanum</title>
		<link>http://www.brendanmyers.net/blog/2011/10/am-i-the-99/#comment-3425</link>
		<dc:creator>Arcanum</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Dec 2011 06:37:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.brendanmyers.net/blog/?p=469#comment-3425</guid>
		<description>As the old Chinese proverb goes - help the needy - not the poor. The poor will always be poor, plus life is not a zero sum equation. That&#039;s why I can&#039;t relate to OWS protesters.

A OWS group tried to protest in a nearby large city by blocking a bridge in a poor part of town - blocking the working poor from going home. The police chief said he wasn&#039;t arresting anyone and all the police left. Furious, the protesters left within the hour. They are a bit of a self-serving bunch.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As the old Chinese proverb goes &#8211; help the needy &#8211; not the poor. The poor will always be poor, plus life is not a zero sum equation. That&#8217;s why I can&#8217;t relate to OWS protesters.</p>
<p>A OWS group tried to protest in a nearby large city by blocking a bridge in a poor part of town &#8211; blocking the working poor from going home. The police chief said he wasn&#8217;t arresting anyone and all the police left. Furious, the protesters left within the hour. They are a bit of a self-serving bunch.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Supporting your &#8220;beyond 101&#8243; writers by Judie Troyansky</title>
		<link>http://www.brendanmyers.net/blog/2011/07/supporting-your-beyond-101-writers/#comment-3101</link>
		<dc:creator>Judie Troyansky</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 31 Jul 2011 16:10:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.brendanmyers.net/blog/?p=464#comment-3101</guid>
		<description>I think that e-publishing might be able to help in this situation. The basic problem, IMHO, is that print publishers have to look at the print run - how many books have to be sold, and at what price, to surpass the break-even on the cost of printing the book. That&#039;s why so many text books are priced in the hundreds of dollars. (Small market with limited interest equals higher price) And its the printing costs that make up the majority of the publisher&#039;s overhead on a per-book basis.

All books have to be written and layouts have to be done and covers have to be made. But e-books don&#039;t have to worry about press runs or warehouse storage or returns on unsold books. 

So maybe its time for Pagans to follow the trend and create a niche market ebook publisher - Pagan books: 101 and beyond :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think that e-publishing might be able to help in this situation. The basic problem, IMHO, is that print publishers have to look at the print run &#8211; how many books have to be sold, and at what price, to surpass the break-even on the cost of printing the book. That&#8217;s why so many text books are priced in the hundreds of dollars. (Small market with limited interest equals higher price) And its the printing costs that make up the majority of the publisher&#8217;s overhead on a per-book basis.</p>
<p>All books have to be written and layouts have to be done and covers have to be made. But e-books don&#8217;t have to worry about press runs or warehouse storage or returns on unsold books. </p>
<p>So maybe its time for Pagans to follow the trend and create a niche market ebook publisher &#8211; Pagan books: 101 and beyond <img src='http://www.brendanmyers.net/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>Comment on Supporting your &#8220;beyond 101&#8243; writers by bj</title>
		<link>http://www.brendanmyers.net/blog/2011/07/supporting-your-beyond-101-writers/#comment-3076</link>
		<dc:creator>bj</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 27 Jul 2011 12:24:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.brendanmyers.net/blog/?p=464#comment-3076</guid>
		<description>why not try picking a half dozen worthy/important &quot;pagan&quot; books of substance and do a bit of sleuthing about how they came to be successfully distributed.

in reading the comments i particularly noted and agreed with the sentiments about genre books.  they do narrow your target market....even though with &quot;pagan&quot; books the subject matter may be relevant for more than those people who self identify as pagan....the label could be thus damning.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>why not try picking a half dozen worthy/important &#8220;pagan&#8221; books of substance and do a bit of sleuthing about how they came to be successfully distributed.</p>
<p>in reading the comments i particularly noted and agreed with the sentiments about genre books.  they do narrow your target market&#8230;.even though with &#8220;pagan&#8221; books the subject matter may be relevant for more than those people who self identify as pagan&#8230;.the label could be thus damning.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Supporting your &#8220;beyond 101&#8243; writers by Jane H</title>
		<link>http://www.brendanmyers.net/blog/2011/07/supporting-your-beyond-101-writers/#comment-3062</link>
		<dc:creator>Jane H</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 Jul 2011 01:05:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.brendanmyers.net/blog/?p=464#comment-3062</guid>
		<description>First, let me thank you for this article and apologize for the length of my response, but I stand in the middle between the publisher and the reader.

As a bookseller, I can tell you that there is a market for more advanced works, but not as big as the market for intro level books, for a couple of reasons: First, a more detailed and in-depth book focuses on a specific topic and thus speaks to fewer people than a broad introduction. Second, some people never advance beyond 101. They jump ship or pick another path to study. 

To help fill that need, small presses in the US are using Print On Demand (POD) to try to fill in the gap left by some major publishers. (Note that a major metaphysical/pagan publisher isn&#039;t that big compared to the ones which put out New York Times Bestsellers). But frankly, often their covers are poorly designed (most people do judge a book by the cover) and small presses do have a problem getting both the word out and their books into stores. Barnes &amp; Noble is just too big and their buyers probably wouldn&#039;t give an independent press much notice. 

There is no way to make a Pagan book a bestseller like there is in the mainstream. There is no media equivalent of the Oprah Book Club for Pagans. When I, as a bookseller, search for good titles to carry, I find dated recommended book lists where as many as half of the titles are out of print or only available overseas. Nor is there an equivalent of Christianity Today in print or online. The closest thing is the Patheos Pagan Portal, and that is a relatively new thing. How many pagans out there know of it? So even if a book is reviewed, how many people read that review? 

Getting the books into specialty stores:

Independent stores like ours prefer to work with large book distributors or specialty distributors like AzureGreen, New Leaf, or lately, MagusBooks, because we only stock one or two of most titles.  But lately the distributors are failing to keep small-press books in stock, they are &quot;available to back-order&quot; but it might take a month to get them in because they wait until there are enough to order. Many indie publishers have just gone with the Amazon/Createspace model so they can sell both e-Books and Print-On-Demand with the full marketing of Amazon, basically bypassing indies like us. For instance, when I just searched &quot;Loneliness and Revelation&quot; on Baker &amp; Taylor, it&#039;s available to back-order. So, if I want to get it in any sooner, I need to track it back in the supply chain to O Books then to NBN Distributors, then to a .pdf of a list of reps who I need to contact via e-mail. Then there are new minimums we need to meet, so we need to try to select even more titles from the publisher, with mostly just intuition/gut instinct, the title and the cover to tell us what we should carry. 

The other place we&#039;re finding interesting books is academic presses. But often these are not offered by distributors and we have to order direct. They are also often very low margin, AKA no profit, books, and they often require a large number of copies of a single title. So if they aren&#039;t pre-sold, it&#039;s pretty-much a no go for us. We found out about these books through a local academic who lead an &quot;Egghead Pagans Book Club&quot; at our store a couple of years back. With more than a dozen members, and a strong beginning, we worked hard to track down the books and get them from the publishers. But in the end, we got burned on many of the titles because only two or three would buy the book (they&#039;d get it from the library) or they would buy it on Amazon to save two bucks. Also, it turns out one of the books was available as a free PDF online.

Large publishers know how to market intro books but are clueless as to how to market &quot;smart&quot; niche books. They think they don&#039;t sell because they slap a semi-comic-book cover on it and a &quot;catchy&quot; title which misrepresents the book. This does get a certain segment to pick it up and page through a bit and find it too obtuse and put it down. But the people who would actually want the book, find it useful and challenging and all those good things won&#039;t even pick it up because it looks like a 101 book. So we, as booksellers have to hand-sell them. &quot;The cover is awful, and the title misleading, but but the book is wonderful, here . . . look inside.&quot;

The other problem with some of the larger publishing houses is simply the expertise required to be able to judge a more advanced manuscript. How many times have you picked up a book which was supposed to be more advanced and found out it&#039;s just 101 1/2, a different angle of rehash of the same topics as the basics beginners book?

So what do we do?  How do we get the good works out there and into the hands (and heads) of the readers?  I love the idea of a Book Club model, both online and off. I&#039;d like there to be something which would include independent stores like ours, who could supply the books as well as meeting space, because I&#039;d love to participate. But it should also be available in other areas without a local store or center to host, or for people just on the internet.

Heck, I&#039;d even be happy with just an ongoing list of beyond 101 books worth pursuing and reading. I&#039;d like a Pagan &quot;Shelf Awareness&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>First, let me thank you for this article and apologize for the length of my response, but I stand in the middle between the publisher and the reader.</p>
<p>As a bookseller, I can tell you that there is a market for more advanced works, but not as big as the market for intro level books, for a couple of reasons: First, a more detailed and in-depth book focuses on a specific topic and thus speaks to fewer people than a broad introduction. Second, some people never advance beyond 101. They jump ship or pick another path to study. </p>
<p>To help fill that need, small presses in the US are using Print On Demand (POD) to try to fill in the gap left by some major publishers. (Note that a major metaphysical/pagan publisher isn&#8217;t that big compared to the ones which put out New York Times Bestsellers). But frankly, often their covers are poorly designed (most people do judge a book by the cover) and small presses do have a problem getting both the word out and their books into stores. Barnes &amp; Noble is just too big and their buyers probably wouldn&#8217;t give an independent press much notice. </p>
<p>There is no way to make a Pagan book a bestseller like there is in the mainstream. There is no media equivalent of the Oprah Book Club for Pagans. When I, as a bookseller, search for good titles to carry, I find dated recommended book lists where as many as half of the titles are out of print or only available overseas. Nor is there an equivalent of Christianity Today in print or online. The closest thing is the Patheos Pagan Portal, and that is a relatively new thing. How many pagans out there know of it? So even if a book is reviewed, how many people read that review? </p>
<p>Getting the books into specialty stores:</p>
<p>Independent stores like ours prefer to work with large book distributors or specialty distributors like AzureGreen, New Leaf, or lately, MagusBooks, because we only stock one or two of most titles.  But lately the distributors are failing to keep small-press books in stock, they are &#8220;available to back-order&#8221; but it might take a month to get them in because they wait until there are enough to order. Many indie publishers have just gone with the Amazon/Createspace model so they can sell both e-Books and Print-On-Demand with the full marketing of Amazon, basically bypassing indies like us. For instance, when I just searched &#8220;Loneliness and Revelation&#8221; on Baker &amp; Taylor, it&#8217;s available to back-order. So, if I want to get it in any sooner, I need to track it back in the supply chain to O Books then to NBN Distributors, then to a .pdf of a list of reps who I need to contact via e-mail. Then there are new minimums we need to meet, so we need to try to select even more titles from the publisher, with mostly just intuition/gut instinct, the title and the cover to tell us what we should carry. </p>
<p>The other place we&#8217;re finding interesting books is academic presses. But often these are not offered by distributors and we have to order direct. They are also often very low margin, AKA no profit, books, and they often require a large number of copies of a single title. So if they aren&#8217;t pre-sold, it&#8217;s pretty-much a no go for us. We found out about these books through a local academic who lead an &#8220;Egghead Pagans Book Club&#8221; at our store a couple of years back. With more than a dozen members, and a strong beginning, we worked hard to track down the books and get them from the publishers. But in the end, we got burned on many of the titles because only two or three would buy the book (they&#8217;d get it from the library) or they would buy it on Amazon to save two bucks. Also, it turns out one of the books was available as a free PDF online.</p>
<p>Large publishers know how to market intro books but are clueless as to how to market &#8220;smart&#8221; niche books. They think they don&#8217;t sell because they slap a semi-comic-book cover on it and a &#8220;catchy&#8221; title which misrepresents the book. This does get a certain segment to pick it up and page through a bit and find it too obtuse and put it down. But the people who would actually want the book, find it useful and challenging and all those good things won&#8217;t even pick it up because it looks like a 101 book. So we, as booksellers have to hand-sell them. &#8220;The cover is awful, and the title misleading, but but the book is wonderful, here . . . look inside.&#8221;</p>
<p>The other problem with some of the larger publishing houses is simply the expertise required to be able to judge a more advanced manuscript. How many times have you picked up a book which was supposed to be more advanced and found out it&#8217;s just 101 1/2, a different angle of rehash of the same topics as the basics beginners book?</p>
<p>So what do we do?  How do we get the good works out there and into the hands (and heads) of the readers?  I love the idea of a Book Club model, both online and off. I&#8217;d like there to be something which would include independent stores like ours, who could supply the books as well as meeting space, because I&#8217;d love to participate. But it should also be available in other areas without a local store or center to host, or for people just on the internet.</p>
<p>Heck, I&#8217;d even be happy with just an ongoing list of beyond 101 books worth pursuing and reading. I&#8217;d like a Pagan &#8220;Shelf Awareness&#8221;</p>
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		<title>Comment on Supporting your &#8220;beyond 101&#8243; writers by David Carron</title>
		<link>http://www.brendanmyers.net/blog/2011/07/supporting-your-beyond-101-writers/#comment-3057</link>
		<dc:creator>David Carron</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 25 Jul 2011 21:10:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.brendanmyers.net/blog/?p=464#comment-3057</guid>
		<description>Aren&#039;t most of the supply side issues mostly resolved via the internet, specifically with the Print On Demand and electronic publishing?  There should be little excuse for folks not producing.  There certainly are limited buyers but for almost 0 start up, what is there is to complain about in the Internet Age besides a like of content?  (Not to mention the occasional free podcast...)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Aren&#8217;t most of the supply side issues mostly resolved via the internet, specifically with the Print On Demand and electronic publishing?  There should be little excuse for folks not producing.  There certainly are limited buyers but for almost 0 start up, what is there is to complain about in the Internet Age besides a like of content?  (Not to mention the occasional free podcast&#8230;)</p>
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		<title>Comment on Supporting your &#8220;beyond 101&#8243; writers by Winter</title>
		<link>http://www.brendanmyers.net/blog/2011/07/supporting-your-beyond-101-writers/#comment-3056</link>
		<dc:creator>Winter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 25 Jul 2011 19:40:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.brendanmyers.net/blog/?p=464#comment-3056</guid>
		<description>As one who finds the &quot;101 level&quot; books to be such horrid, superficial fluff, it&#039;s devastating to think about all of the well-written, thought-provoking books that aren&#039;t being published because they might not be able to raise enough hype to fly off shelves.
In an era where bestsellers are written by the likes of Stephenie Meyer and &quot;Snooki&quot;, it&#039;s small wonder that anything with a modicum of depth and challenge would cause a publisher to hem and haw with the concern that it wouldn&#039;t make a considerable profit. 
Sigh.

As a side note, I would be delighted to join a Pagan book club, should anyone start one in the Toronto era.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As one who finds the &#8220;101 level&#8221; books to be such horrid, superficial fluff, it&#8217;s devastating to think about all of the well-written, thought-provoking books that aren&#8217;t being published because they might not be able to raise enough hype to fly off shelves.<br />
In an era where bestsellers are written by the likes of Stephenie Meyer and &#8220;Snooki&#8221;, it&#8217;s small wonder that anything with a modicum of depth and challenge would cause a publisher to hem and haw with the concern that it wouldn&#8217;t make a considerable profit.<br />
Sigh.</p>
<p>As a side note, I would be delighted to join a Pagan book club, should anyone start one in the Toronto era.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Supporting your &#8220;beyond 101&#8243; writers by Brendan</title>
		<link>http://www.brendanmyers.net/blog/2011/07/supporting-your-beyond-101-writers/#comment-3054</link>
		<dc:creator>Brendan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 25 Jul 2011 19:07:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.brendanmyers.net/blog/?p=464#comment-3054</guid>
		<description>Pass a few of them to me once in a while, if you like.  I&#039;ll review them. :-)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Pass a few of them to me once in a while, if you like.  I&#8217;ll review them. <img src='http://www.brendanmyers.net/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>Comment on Supporting your &#8220;beyond 101&#8243; writers by Graeme Talboys</title>
		<link>http://www.brendanmyers.net/blog/2011/07/supporting-your-beyond-101-writers/#comment-3053</link>
		<dc:creator>Graeme Talboys</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 25 Jul 2011 19:04:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.brendanmyers.net/blog/?p=464#comment-3053</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m a writer and a publisher. I would certainly publish more of these advanced texts if I could solve a few problems. Some are technical and require me to work at them (e.g., producing quality looking material although we don&#039;t do too badly at this) but this requires the one thing I don&#039;t have - money. It&#039;s a Catch 22 situation. If the books sold, I&#039;d have the cash. If I had the cash, I could produce and sell the books. Marketing and distribution are the big barriers. I&#039;m based in the UK and know nothing about the USA and Canada in terms of book distribution and marketing. And of course, the other issue is time. My publishing activities have to fit in with my own attempt to earn a living (not helped by the linked facts that [a] I&#039;m disabled and being limited in what I can do have [b] chosen to try to earn money by writing). There are some interesting ideas here to be considered. And if anyone has ideas of how I can get current and future books into North America I&#039;d be grateful to hear them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m a writer and a publisher. I would certainly publish more of these advanced texts if I could solve a few problems. Some are technical and require me to work at them (e.g., producing quality looking material although we don&#8217;t do too badly at this) but this requires the one thing I don&#8217;t have &#8211; money. It&#8217;s a Catch 22 situation. If the books sold, I&#8217;d have the cash. If I had the cash, I could produce and sell the books. Marketing and distribution are the big barriers. I&#8217;m based in the UK and know nothing about the USA and Canada in terms of book distribution and marketing. And of course, the other issue is time. My publishing activities have to fit in with my own attempt to earn a living (not helped by the linked facts that [a] I&#8217;m disabled and being limited in what I can do have [b] chosen to try to earn money by writing). There are some interesting ideas here to be considered. And if anyone has ideas of how I can get current and future books into North America I&#8217;d be grateful to hear them.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Supporting your &#8220;beyond 101&#8243; writers by Sam Wagar</title>
		<link>http://www.brendanmyers.net/blog/2011/07/supporting-your-beyond-101-writers/#comment-3052</link>
		<dc:creator>Sam Wagar</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 25 Jul 2011 19:01:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.brendanmyers.net/blog/?p=464#comment-3052</guid>
		<description>Good thoughts, Brendan. To elaborate on point three on your list - introductory material and simple material will always be dominant. Most people do not feel the need to challenge themselves, to go deeper, or to experience life more intensely than they already do. Look in every area of publishing - there is a great whack of elementary material and very few jewels. Pap dominates because people like it. 

Now, I do my bit to try to raise the bar. I had a wonderful time teaching the graduate-level course in ritual theory through Avalon College this year and look forward to offering some more serious academic work. I read and recommend serious pieces, including those books of yours I have (need to get the lonliness one soon). Clergy training at CWABC and CWAA has some intellectual rigour and we are bringing forward people with a taste for the depths. 

And a last point - I generally don&#039;t read &quot;Pagan&quot; books (with exceptions) but books dealing with topics that interest me, which often include ritual, mythology, philosophy etc.  Genre writing is also problematic.

Blessings,

sam</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good thoughts, Brendan. To elaborate on point three on your list &#8211; introductory material and simple material will always be dominant. Most people do not feel the need to challenge themselves, to go deeper, or to experience life more intensely than they already do. Look in every area of publishing &#8211; there is a great whack of elementary material and very few jewels. Pap dominates because people like it. </p>
<p>Now, I do my bit to try to raise the bar. I had a wonderful time teaching the graduate-level course in ritual theory through Avalon College this year and look forward to offering some more serious academic work. I read and recommend serious pieces, including those books of yours I have (need to get the lonliness one soon). Clergy training at CWABC and CWAA has some intellectual rigour and we are bringing forward people with a taste for the depths. </p>
<p>And a last point &#8211; I generally don&#8217;t read &#8220;Pagan&#8221; books (with exceptions) but books dealing with topics that interest me, which often include ritual, mythology, philosophy etc.  Genre writing is also problematic.</p>
<p>Blessings,</p>
<p>sam</p>
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		<title>Comment on Supporting your &#8220;beyond 101&#8243; writers by Star Foster</title>
		<link>http://www.brendanmyers.net/blog/2011/07/supporting-your-beyond-101-writers/#comment-3051</link>
		<dc:creator>Star Foster</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 25 Jul 2011 18:19:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.brendanmyers.net/blog/?p=464#comment-3051</guid>
		<description>As someone who receives a lot of books to review, I can tell you that finding the time to read and review them is always an issue for me. Plus, there is an art to reviewing a book as well as writing it. Some people simply aren&#039;t good at reviewing books.

I think the book club idea is a good one. There need to be more Pagan book clubs.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As someone who receives a lot of books to review, I can tell you that finding the time to read and review them is always an issue for me. Plus, there is an art to reviewing a book as well as writing it. Some people simply aren&#8217;t good at reviewing books.</p>
<p>I think the book club idea is a good one. There need to be more Pagan book clubs.</p>
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